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  #34621 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 07:49 AM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
How can the CBN flood the market with what it doesn't have?

Your tingling is very wrong. Demand is very real

A sustained sale of what you don't have and tighter control on an already collapsing economy? Ok na, i hope you are not a government adviser
Hmmmm!

In my line of business at times you can actually borrow what you dont have and sell.. (Short Selling)

I only hope they will find those ready to lend them the dollars to short sell.. and hopefully that they will also see it to buy back later at a lower cost...
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  #34622 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 10:01 AM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
From my experience the herdsmen issue is like a husband and wife matter. By and large herdsmen respect farm boundaries but lets be honest, we are talking of cows and sometimes they stray and much at the wrong crops. When this happens some farmers take violent measures and purposely plant poisonous crops in their farms or do things that they know hurt the cows. This causes resentment and some of the herdsmen maliciously take their eating machines into farms deliberately. Then we also have cattle rustlers who go into the bush, kill the herdsmen and steal their herds. I never knew how prevalent this crime was until i went into farming. From what I hear the crime of cattle rustling is bigger than armed robbery in Nigeria.
Very informed comments. As a farmer myself, I can attest to these facts.
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  #34623 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 02:40 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
From my experience the herdsmen issue is like a husband and wife matter. By and large herdsmen respect farm boundaries but lets be honest, we are talking of cows and sometimes they stray and much at the wrong crops. When this happens some farmers take violent measures and purposely plant poisonous crops in their farms or do things that they know hurt the cows. This causes resentment and some of the herdsmen maliciously take their eating machines into farms deliberately. Then we also have cattle rustlers who go into the bush, kill the herdsmen and steal their herds. I never knew how prevalent this crime was until i went into farming. From what I hear the crime of cattle rustling is bigger than armed robbery in Nigeria.
The current herdsmen crisis is worsened by the desert encroachment in the north and rural urban migration.

In this age, we should not be seeing cattle on major roads. We should not have cattle grazing on farmland. We need to solve the FUNDAMENTAL issue first.
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  #34624 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 03:07 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanaj0 View Post
The current herdsmen crisis is worsened by the desert encroachment in the north and rural urban migration.

In this age, we should not be seeing cattle on major roads. We should not have cattle grazing on farmland. We need to solve the FUNDAMENTAL issue first.
Very true and this one certainly requires Government intervention in terms of law enforcement plus both legislative and executive action or else unsavory incidents will continue to happen at different scales of violence.
What are your thoughts on how this can be resolved in such a way that balances the various interests i.e. herdsmen, farmers, national and regional interests ?

Someone suggested the Government needs to come up with a centralized policy action on the problem instead of the current disparate pronouncements by the likes of the minister of Agriculture on issues like ranching and grazing reserves which give room for misinformation and politicking to a long standing problem which is becoming more serious by the day. I hate to think that some innocent people engaged in productive activities would be kidnapped or killed on their farm even though Oga Nosa presently doesnt have this problem.

Perhaps some form of Legislative and executive coordination might help if differences can be put aside for the public good to educate and resettle this herdsmen and either stop this migrant culture completely or at least significantly reduce it to the barest minimum for solely historical and tourism purposes.

Last edited by duduspace; 16th September 2016 at 03:11 PM.
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  #34625 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 03:11 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanaj0 View Post
The current herdsmen crisis is worsened by the desert encroachment in the north and rural urban migration.

In this age, we should not be seeing cattle on major roads. We should not have cattle grazing on farmland. We need to solve the FUNDAMENTAL issue first.
Exactly. I don't have any numbers to back it up but from my common sense analogy I believe it will be more profitable and safer to have cows in a ranch. How expensive would it be if the cows in my area were kept in a place and the ranch owner came to collect my bush clearing after I'm done.

{at risk of going APC vs PDP} I have to state that government has really failed in structuring the farming industry in this country. And when I say government I mean all governments since 1914, yes even the oyinbo join.
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  #34626 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 03:15 PM
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Originally Posted by duduspace View Post
Very true and this one certainly requires Government intervention in terms of law enforcement plus both legislative and executive action or else unsavory incidents will continue to happen at different scales of violence.
What are your thoughts on how this can be resolved in such a way that balances the various interests i.e. herdsmen, farmers, national and regional interests ?

Someone suggested the Government needs to come up with a centralized policy action on the problem instead of the current disparate pronouncements by the likes of the minister of Agriculture on issues like ranching and grazing reserves which give room for misinformation and politicking to a long standing problem which is becoming more serious by the day. I hate to think that some innocent people engaged in productive activities would be kidnapped or killed on their farm even though Oga Nosa presently doesnt have this problem.

Perhaps some form of Legislative and executive coordination might help if differences can be put aside for the public good to educate and resettle this herdsmen and either stop this migrant culture completely or at least significantly reduce it to the barest minimum for solely historical and tourism purposes.
When cows first entered my plantain farm in Benin my knee jerk reaction was to plant poisonous crops amidst my plantain. If I had done that I'm sure I would have had some herdsmen planning for me.

The truth is, without a disincentive for cow owners, who by the way are mostly big men, to change their ways, the herdsmen/farmer crisis will persists.
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  #34627 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 03:16 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by wanaj0 View Post
The current herdsmen crisis is worsened by the desert encroachment in the north and rural urban migration.

In this age, we should not be seeing cattle on major roads. We should not have cattle grazing on farmland. We need to solve the FUNDAMENTAL issue first.
never really thought of that but it makes perfect sense. Climate change at work
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  #34628 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:27 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
never really thought of that but it makes perfect sense. Climate change at work
No, this is not climate change at work. It is neglect by succesive Nigerian government for decades. Desert encroachment has been a phenomenon for ever in Nigeria and experts have been warning Nigeria for at least 50 years. There have been calls to plant desert resistant plants like Jojoba for decades to create buffer zones but no government listened. Now, the economic and social consequences are upon us just like our reliance solely on oil as a source of revenue for decades and we want some people to perform magic.
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  #34629 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:37 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
Exactly. I don't have any numbers to back it up but from my common sense analogy I believe it will be more profitable and safer to have cows in a ranch. How expensive would it be if the cows in my area were kept in a place and the ranch owner came to collect my bush clearing after I'm done.

{at risk of going APC vs PDP} I have to state that government has really failed in structuring the farming industry in this country. And when I say government I mean all governments since 1914, yes even the oyinbo join.
The oyinbo's never had your interest anyway. Their interest was to get as much resources as they could at the least cost. Remember it was uac that was the fore runner. It is our own responsibility to start to correct whatever they did wrong to ensure the continuing survival of our descendants. With the benefits of hindsight, I think we have failed woefully. What we need to focus on now is how we can turn the tide. Not demanding an overnight miracle to score political point.
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  #34630 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:41 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
Exactly. I don't have any numbers to back it up but from my common sense analogy I believe it will be more profitable and safer to have cows in a ranch. How expensive would it be if the cows in my area were kept in a place and the ranch owner came to collect my bush clearing after I'm done.

{at risk of going APC vs PDP} I have to state that government has really failed in structuring the farming industry in this country. And when I say government I mean all governments since 1914, yes even the oyinbo join.
The colonials planned for reserves and grazing routes in line with existing migratory patterns that even the tribes in the pre-colonial era lived with and they were sufficient for those times. It is our own fault that we have not leveraged on that to evolve our own systems in line with our development..
The europeans still have their migratory communities like the Gypsies that even cross national boundaries because they acknowledge that some people do not want to change their way of life. They only handle them via laws and policies by acknowledging their interests too.

Society either evolves or mutates. Mutation usually comes with sudden severe consequences while evolution is more gradual and less severe as shocks and changes are absorbed gradually over time. Nigeria has to make a call on the migrant herdsmen issue at some point. Some call for a mutation but Im not sure that they are prepared for potential fallouts, others have latched unto it to score political points.
Either way, Government will have to make a call at some point and if not this government, then another one. In the interim, I think band aid millitary and police action will suffice for now but it will be in no way near adequate.

Last edited by duduspace; 16th September 2016 at 04:43 PM.
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  #34631 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:46 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by dupeodus View Post
No, this is not climate change at work. It is neglect by succesive Nigerian government for decades. Desert encroachment has been a phenomenon for ever in Nigeria and experts have been warning Nigeria for at least 50 years. There have been calls to plant desert resistant plants like Jojoba for decades to create buffer zones but no government listened. Now, the economic and social consequences are upon us just like our reliance solely on oil as a source of revenue for decades and we want some people to perform magic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dupeodus View Post
The oyinbo's never had your interest anyway. Their interest was to get as much resources as they could at the least cost. Remember it was uac that was the fore runner. It is our own responsibility to start to correct whatever they did wrong to ensure the continuing survival of our descendants. With the benefits of hindsight, I think we have failed woefully. What we need to focus on now is how we can turn the tide. Not demanding an overnight miracle to score political point.
PDP vs APC alert!!!

Commenters beware
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Last edited by nosa2; 16th September 2016 at 04:48 PM.
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  #34632 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:51 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by dupeodus View Post
No, this is not climate change at work. It is neglect by succesive Nigerian government for decades. Desert encroachment has been a phenomenon for ever in Nigeria and experts have been warning Nigeria for at least 50 years. There have been calls to plant desert resistant plants like Jojoba for decades to create buffer zones but no government listened. Now, the economic and social consequences are upon us just like our reliance solely on oil as a source of revenue for decades and we want some people to perform magic.
That is why the recent calls for saving the Lake Chad basin becomes more important by the day. For some, the drying up of the Lake Chad is the foundation of the BH problem that allowed religious extremism to fester and why it affects 4 different countries. Of course, some of a political bent will want people to think otherwise.
What people dont however seem to realize is that a neighbor's problem has a tendency to become one's problem too because as human beings we will do almost anything when our very survival is threatened.

If all these emanciated BH footsoldiers were busy farming on the Lake Chad for example, would they even have time to losten to any rabble rousing religious fundamentalist ?
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  #34633 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:56 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

Quote:
Originally Posted by duduspace View Post
The colonials planned for reserves and grazing routes in line with existing migratory patterns that even the tribes in the pre-colonial era lived with and they were sufficient for those times. It is our own fault that we have not leveraged on that to evolve our own systems in line with our development..
The europeans still have their migratory communities like the Gypsies that even cross national boundaries because they acknowledge that some people do not want to change their way of life. They only handle them via laws and policies by acknowledging their interests too.

Society either evolves or mutates. Mutation usually comes with sudden severe consequences while evolution is more gradual and less severe as shocks and changes are absorbed gradually over time. Nigeria has to make a call on the migrant herdsmen issue at some point. Some call for a mutation but Im not sure that they are prepared for potential fallouts, others have latched unto it to score political points.
Either way, Government will have to make a call at some point and if not this government, then another one. In the interim, I think band aid millitary and police action will suffice for now but it will be in no way near adequate.
We have to fix it as a country. I personally can't see how a police/military action will work. Herdsmen are mostly in very remote areas. If I use my farm as a yardstick, i believe the nearest police station to my place would be like 45 minutes drive away, how do we get policemen to cover these areas? Can we even afford to police these areas? The only solution i can see is for us to get cattle owners to build ranches. How we get cattle owners to build ranches is anyones guess.
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  #34634 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 04:56 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
PDP vs APC alert!!!

Commenters beware
No. This has nothing to do with PDP Vs APC. I have been, and I am still critical of the economic policies of the current APC government. However, one must state the truth if we want to make progress. Insisting on taking measures to make things look normal when we know that we must suffer the consequences of our horrible decisions in the past to have any chance of turning things around can only dig us further into the whole.
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  #34635 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by dupeodus View Post
No. This has nothing to do with PDP Vs APC. I have been, and I am still critical of the economic policies of the current APC government. However, one must state the truth if we want to make progress. Insisting on taking measures to make things look normal when we know that we must suffer the consequences of our horrible decisions in the past to have any chance of turning things around can only dig us further into the whole.
Can with a straight face really say that you can't see how this line of discussion will lead us down the PDP vs APC road?

Aren't we tired of the endless argument ?
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  #34636 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 05:05 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by duduspace View Post
That is why the recent calls for saving the Lake Chad basin becomes more important by the day. For some, the drying up of the Lake Chad is the foundation of the BH problem that allowed religious extremism to fester and why it affects 4 different countries. Of course, some of a political bent will want people to think otherwise.
What people dont however seem to realize is that a neighbor's problem has a tendency to become one's problem too because as human beings we will do almost anything when our very survival is threatened.

If all these emanciated BH footsoldiers were busy farming on the Lake Chad for example, would they even have time to losten to any rabble rousing religious fundamentalist ?
That calls to question, the decision to prospect for oil in the Lake Chad basin. Even if there is oil there, the place should be left untouched. The economic value of oil is reducing and we are not considering the total cost of drilling for oil in Lake child. Some better tell this government that the costs of drilling for oil in Lake Chad outweighs it's benefits. The opposition have always been that the government is using money from Southern oil to look for oil in the north so the north could be independent. This would never fly. I have always dismissed the opposition to oil drilling in Lake Chad for this reason until we start this line of debate.
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Old 16th September 2016, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
Can with a straight face really say that you can't see how this line of discussion will lead us down the PDP vs APC road?

Aren't we tired of the endless argument ?
I do see your point. I will avoid that in future posts.
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  #34638 (permalink)  
Old 16th September 2016, 06:32 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by nosa2 View Post
Exactly. I don't have any numbers to back it up but from my common sense analogy I believe it will be more profitable and safer to have cows in a ranch. How expensive would it be if the cows in my area were kept in a place and the ranch owner came to collect my bush clearing after I'm done.

{at risk of going APC vs PDP} I have to state that government has really failed in structuring the farming industry in this country. And when I say government I mean all governments since 1914, yes even the oyinbo join.
You no well o. You don't want the cows to do exercise abi. You want them to stay in one place and have arthritis abi?

Those cows need to jog from one farm to another jare!
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Old 16th September 2016, 06:42 PM
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Default Re: MarketWatch

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Originally Posted by wanaj0 View Post
The current herdsmen crisis is worsened by the desert encroachment in the north and rural urban migration.

In this age, we should not be seeing cattle on major roads. We should not have cattle grazing on farmland. We need to solve the FUNDAMENTAL issue first.
People can't just think. Turn the desert green again. Plant trees. Large trees and form a wall that will help break the eroding effect of the winds.

See the Great Green wall project.
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Old 16th September 2016, 07:34 PM
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That calls to question, the decision to prospect for oil in the Lake Chad basin. Even if there is oil there, the place should be left untouched. The economic value of oil is reducing and we are not considering the total cost of drilling for oil in Lake child. Some better tell this government that the costs of drilling for oil in Lake Chad outweighs it's benefits. The opposition have always been that the government is using money from Southern oil to look for oil in the north so the north could be independent. This would never fly. I have always dismissed the opposition to oil drilling in Lake Chad for this reason until we start this line of debate.
The issue is that there is talk that one of the countries in the Lake Cad basin is already producing oil from the basin (to what scale and extent I really do not know) and I think that country is Chad.
Infact it was once rumored (apparetly untrue from later events and what is now more widely known of the problem) that it was Chad sponsoring the BH issue to stop Nigeria ever producing oil from our own side of the basin.
I dont doubt that BH has been sponsored at different times by different people for different reasons but what cannot be disputed is that life in that part of Nigeria is bein changed (probably irreversibly) by the drying up of the Lake occasioned by climate change and that needs sorting or even the current lull in fighting might be the calm before yet another storm.

Last edited by duduspace; 16th September 2016 at 08:04 PM.
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